May-19-2013 3:41 AM
The first thing I thought when I first heard about Pacific Rim ages ago was that it struck me as being very Lovecraftian. I noticed similarities to Godzilla, Evangelion, Gundam Wing/Mobile Suit Gundam, Getter Robot and Great Mazinger (to name a few). I mean, a LOT of Mecha/Robot Anime stories center around the same things you listed as being unique to Evangelion (i.e: the threat to earth by aliens/monsters, humans building giant robots to defend earth from said threat, humans piloting the Robots, etc.). Just look at a couple:
Here is the Synopsis for "[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDjkXkMTg-c]Great Mazinger[/url]" Circa 1974
[i]"The story centers on Tetsuya Tsurugi, an orphan raised by none other than Kenzo Kabuto, the once thought dead father of Mazinger Z pilot Kouji Kabuto. Kenzo Kabuto is the creator of the new, improved version of Mazinger, made by refining his father's Chogokin Z (Super Alloy Z) into a new, stronger form, designed to fight against humanity's new enemy, the Mycenae Empire, led by the Great General of Darkness and his army of Warrior Beasts."[/i]
Here is the Synopsis for "[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nhjds5BtY68]Getter Robot[/url]" Circa 1975
[i]"The plot involves three strong-willed teenagers: martial artist Ryoma Nagare, homicidal psychopath Hayato Jin and fat Judoka Musashi Tomoe, who pilot three specially designed combat jets (Eagle, Jaguar, and Bear) which can be combined together into three different giant robots, Getter-1 (balanced and for flight combat), Getter-2 (fast and for ground combat), and Getter-3 (strong and for marine combat). They were assembled by Prof. Saotome, who conceived the Getter Robo project as a means of deep-space exploration. The Getter machine is powered by an energy source known as Getter Rays, which are the invisible manifestation of the pilot's willpower. it became instead Earth's first line of defense against the Dinosaur Empire, a civilization of reptile-like humanoids who evolved from the now-extinct dinosaurs that roamed the earth millions of years ago. They have lived many years underground after being forced to do so by getter ray radiation from space that did not affect the apes who evolved into humans; they now want to reclaim the Earth as theirs and destroy humanity."[/i]
Anyways, all the Evangelion fans I know are really excited to see Pacific Rim so I guess it's just a matter of opinion. Personally, I believe Pacific Rim is Del Toro's homage to the Mecha/Robo Anime genre and he will do it justice. Also, don't forget it's more than likely this movie will get fans who don't know anything about Evangelion to take an interest and start watching the series. :D
May-19-2013 4:24 PM
As Svanya´s showed, yes lot of robot stories are centered in the same thing, about evangelion and P.R. ^^ I think all the P.R. fans in here know about it but ---we dont care! because we want see freaking giant robots fighting a kaiju on the big screen in a decent movie, IMO. :) I can´t wait to see it and I do hope Del Toro give us as he promissed.
@ Svanya aww :D Mazinger
The world will spin well past our last breath, but I will always care about you
May-19-2013 5:30 PM
@**AL**; Oh my gosh, I just realized your signature image is Mazinger!! That is so awesome!!! I agree, the movie is going to great, Del Toro is a wonderful director and he is doing a superb homage to the Mecha/Robot Anime genre. I am avoiding most of the Trailers so I can be surprised when I go see it. :D
May-20-2013 12:56 AM
I've read cloze's post and at the end I was thinking ,"Well...we have a list of superficial similarities shared by an number of mecha or kaiju shows in the genre. But whats REALLY different about Eva and Pac Rim?"
The answer is that both shows really aren't about the same thing at all.
Evangelion is the story of a grand conspiracy to change humanity on a cosmic scale. They are performing transhumanism experiments while trying to provoke the change through their special child pilots. The war against the Angels is both a sideshow and bound up in this conspiracy.
Pacific Rim at heart is a simpler war story. The alien Kaiju attack and humanity responds forcefully with its Jaegers. Victory or extinction is the theme. There are no child pilots. The main protagonists are your traditional soldiers, veteran and rookie, as they try to win a unwinnable war.
I've seen a lot of Eva fans get stuck on the fact there are giant monsters and war bots. But as others in this thread have pointed out its hardly unique and the tropes are older then Evangelion. The true difference is in how those tropes are used.
Note: This is how I see it. Its not meant to disparage those who hold different views.
May-20-2013 8:04 PM
Hello there cloze, pleased to meet you!
Let me offer this perspective: An oft quoted comment from GDT calls Pacific Rim a " beautiful poem to giant monsters". What I get from this is he is paying homage to every reference in the genre, and other quotes suggest he's trying to do so without directly quoting from these sources. But he's certainly been influenced by these things, and he's not denying it. It's more like he's sharing his love for them, and his unique position to present this passion in spectacular form.
Up to now we've had lower budget and limited vision films in this genre, and, of course, Transformers. With all due respect, I'd much, much rather see Pacific Rim. I'm familiar with Evangelion and many other Japanese creations, and when considering them relative to PR, two things come to mind: first, no matter what these Japanese concepts would have to be heavily altered to make them viable in a global market and, two, it would be virtually impossible to make a film like PR without at least inadvertently referencing those ideas.
Think of it as a sort of celebration of the things you revere. You and I and many here are the exception, not the rule, when it comes to awareness of these things. And I agree with Svanya, when all is said and done, PR could generate a broader demand for things like Evangelion.
May-22-2013 1:08 AM
When I first saw the first trailer, yes, Evangelion was the first thing that came to mind. However, I think you just need to look at this as an homage to works like Evangelion because, quite frankly, Evangelion would not be suitable for the broad audiences summer blockbusters require. It's just too much of a downer.
You do remember Watchmen, right?
May-22-2013 5:21 AM
cloze, you actually made a very good point about the similarities between Pacific Rim and Evangelion. I must admit, I actually dislike Evengelion's plot because I found it ridiculous. However, I do agree that it is very influential in the animeverse.
However, your point of plagiarism is rather wrong, though. Guillermo Del Toro has already pointed out all the influences from Japanese productions like Godzilla being the main influence. To say that he didn't know the film would be similar to other shows would be stupid as he is already aware of it.
But, you did make a good point about the fact that if Evangelion gets a live-action movie for real, other people are gonna say it's a copycat of PR. Unfortunately, if that happens, it won't be the first. It has happened before and not just in film, but in music and even in video games.
For me, I'm just gonna go watch the film and treat it as it's own. I'm actually looking forward to it and I think, design-wise, the Jaegers look damn cool and more realistic than the Evas. Fret not though, Japan has a Jaeger in the film and story-wise, its the first of the five jaegers we'll see in the film.
May-26-2013 3:11 AM
People here seem significantly smarter than people on other sites (especially those ranting about how PacRim is an Eva rip-off), so allow me to educate people as to the differences. These points will be off the top of my head, but I will edit it later to add more differences (because there are MANY). So, for those of you haven't seen Neon Genesis Evangelion, YOU. HAVE. BEEN. WARNED.
With that aside, let's get started.
1) Evangelion can/can't be classified as anything NEAR a Mecha show. Why? Watch the first episode. Learn the mythology of the EVAs. The EVAs are actually biological weapons. They're closer to giant organic beings wearing armor. In fact, the most mechanical thing about them (aside from the Plug entry, more on that later), are their Progressive Knife compartments and the weapons they utilize (beam sniper rifles, progressive knife, beam assault rifles, just to name a few). Yes, I'm not making this up. Just watch the first episode. Hell, JetAlone (a rival "mech" in the show) was more Mecha than ANY Eva. It was a piece of crap, sure, but it was still all mech.
2) Religious overtones. And yes, I said OVERTONES. Anyone who says that Evangelion has religious "undertones" is lying to themselves. Religion permeates throughout ALL of Evangelion. Adam, Eve, Lilith, First/Second/Third Impact, Angels, the Tree of Life...I could go on and on.
3) Synchronization. Probably the single point most people are getting hung up on. It appears that in PacRim, pilots must synch with each other AND the Jaegers. Only one pilot is needed (and recommended) in Evangelion. The one time they had two pilots in an Eva (the episode where we meet Asuka), it sure as hell wasn't intended. Also, that was the only episode it happened in. And it lasted for about 15 minutes.
4) The pilots. Evas can only synch with children. This was one of the driving points of the whole show. No adult could EVER pilot an Eva. Just children. I'm sure there are some compatibility issues in PacRim, but none to the point where they REQUIRE kids. Especially an emo kid with daddy issues who is too busy worrying about gaining his father's love to care about saving the wold. Yeah, like ANYBODY would trust him.
5) Power Supply. To power an EVA, it requires a giant plug. Think electrical outlet. It can, however, be unplugged (used throughout the show to create tension) and then the EVA has a small power supply and must defeat its adversary within 5 minutes (EXTREMELY similar to Ultraman which came WAY before Evangelion). It seems like Jaegers run on an internal power supply and can fight for FAR longer than 5 minutes.
Jul-15-2013 12:10 PM
This scene from the trailer was the nail in the coffin for me. It may be a cool movie, but no creativity whatsoever.
Jul-15-2013 1:09 PM
So, because Crimson Typhoon has one eye, it's a lack of creativity? Right...I forgot Mecha's weren't allowed to have similar features.
Jul-15-2013 3:01 PM
@ Cyanidenailbomb ha!
Jul-18-2013 4:45 AM
Well... to be fair, Evangelion didn't invent the mecha genre at all. We could easily say it rips stuff from series like Mazinger, Gundam, etc... but we don't, because it's its own thing. Del Toro's people already have mentioned Pacific Rim is a homage to all those mech anime and movies, he himself being a huge fan. The biggest homage of all is to the giant monster movie genre itself though, aptly called Kaiju in the movie as well.
That being said, I for one am glad this is not an Evangelion movie. Even if the characters in Pacific Rim were kinda cheesy, I wouldn't have tolerated a movie version of Shinji, with all his unsufferable emo-ness and teenage crap. So thank god for that.
Anyway, the great thing about Pacific Rim is that it's the FIRST giant mecha vs giant monster movie with a real budget. That's what makes it good, that's what makes it unique. It never claims to have invented the genre or anything.
Jul-21-2013 7:45 AM
This scene from Gulliver's Travels really reminded me of Gypsy Danger.